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????'s New TT chip tuning with Scanmaster

M

Mr.Vintage

Active Member
Ok guys got my new TT race chip in, Torco 118 fuel in the tank and my new MTDR's!!!!!

Stock turbo, 42lb adjustable regulator, scanmaster test pipe in place

fuel no vac 35psi 450ish w/0 knock 1st wot 2nd wot then 880ish 3rd wot??

Should I not even worry about 1st and 2nd gear numbers? and just tune off of 3rd gear wot......

Race fuel changing numbers?

Has a slight surge in the top of 3rd (pulling then alittle less pull then pulls and then alittle less........ ) numbers are good 880 and 0 knock

Hate to pull fuel pressure down but thats what scanmaster says want to be around 750ish
Thoughts?
 
Set fuel pressure at the rail to 43 psi with vac line off. Then use the TT chip to reduce the fuel delivery so your 880 02 value goes down. Reduce the chip fuel by stepping on te gas pedal three times like it says in the TT manual.
 
Pay no attention to your BLM's unless you're running a closed loop WOT chip.Cell number is dictated by LV8+MAF+TPS+02 etc ,so the ECM will move to cell it needs.

Like Jarred says, pull fuel via the chip in small increments till you see some small( .5) knock activity then add a little fuel after that point.
Tune in 3rd gear for now, 1st and 2nd gear tuning come later at the track to improve your 60's. Rarely will these cars knock in 1st or even 2nd unless there is huge boost spike in there (i.e. a slipping 1-2 shift), the engine is just not loaded that much under 50 MPH.

I will add that an alky chip can and will have some transitional knock when the timing jumps down low and the alky is coming in.

How I tune on the street is to get the car up to temp and then put it in 3rd gear and get a steady 50-55mph cruise going then I hammer it up to 100-105. You don't want the car shifting down into 2nd when you hammer it,so that's why I go 50-55 beforehand.
 
I will add that when I 've run race gas I can get my NB O2's down into the mid 600's with NO knock....but those numbers make me awfully nervous.

EDIT:
You know, you could leave your tune alone at 880 and turn the boost up a little at a time, that'll lean it out.
 
Thanks for the info
I'm in the car now and trying to tune as far as the boost goes wastegate is shut no boost going to the gate I have nipple from turbo plugged so it's making all the boost it can..... However I'm at 6000' ele boost gauge goes to the red but will not even hit 20psi ( I know factory gauges are weird )

I'll try 50-55 now and see what the SM says........more to come
 
Your getting a "wet" boost gauge soon? The stock one is a crap shoot IMO.
A wide band AFR gauge is helpful too.

FWIW, I used to run 21 psi on stock turbo with race gas.
 
Mr.Vintage said:
Ok 2 runs 50-105
Knock goes up to 3 then back to 0?

Why would it show knock then go away?
Click to expand...

Maybe transitional knock. I could live with 3 degrees of retard. I've seen higher. If it's only for less than a second or so I could live with it. Sometimes carriage tweaks/body flex or exhaust moving can trip the knock detector. Sounds like your having a good time though.
 
Just threw more fuel at it........ It's seems better knock down to almost 0 but 1st and 2nd numbers are mid 400's? Pulls good though :WOOT:
Ya what a blast to think this thing is almost 23yrs old

It's been a good night of learning thanks for the help guys!!!!

I'll keep you posted as things progress
 
I know that 3 dgerees of retard seems like small knock,and I'll agree that it probably won't pop on you anytime soon. But 3 degrees of retard means you're leaving HP on the table. It doesn't take allot of work to tune that out.
Besides, I shamefully have way too much experience with blown HG's and the story of blown HG starts out with " I only had few degrees of KR"
Say what you will,head lift is real, and continued small KR can and will start eating away at the composite backer till the fire ring becomes unsupported and pushes it's way out.

Not to mention the damage pre ignition and detonation do to the rotating assembly. Stock cranks flex, at what HP level? I don't know.But they flex during detonation because of the high cyl pressure that causes detonation. So 3 degrees of retard,continually, will hammer away at your bearings till you are wondering why you only have 10 psi of oil pressure at idle.
And "false knock"? I use to believe I had tons of false knock...and I have 4 pairs of blown headgaskets to prove it.:cry:

I think 810mv at WOT in 3rd gear,at the top of the run sounds "safe" but if you're getting knock then it isn't. Clearly you're combination wants more fuel...or less timing...or less boost.

And how are you looking at O2 mv at the top of 1st and 2nd? unless you're logging them I still wouldn't address 400mv as it may have just been crossing over.

Remember too....stock wideband O2's don't have a very long life in the leaded race gas world. My buddy kevin's lasted all of 6 or 7 runs and maybe another 75 street miles before it virtually locked up at .100 or so.
 
Mr.Vintage said:
Why would it show knock then go away?
Click to expand...


The short answer is that the ECM has done corrections to quell the knock "event"......which is good.... a see-saw knock event is very bad as the ECM can't control the detonation.
 
6 passes with me watching SM like a hawk as soon as it looks weird I'm out of it!! Don't want to hurt the car!! only 9k on the clock
Something to consider is that it was warm out when I started tuning and by the end of night it was nice a cool out.....
? Has anyone run stock turbo full tilt with stock boost gauge? If so how high did it read? Mine will barely touch the bottom of the red (so around 18psi or so it says?) I know they are junk in the race world but I was hoping to avoid a pillar gauges. I just want to keep it factory looking but run as HARD as possible.....

As far as mods go: 42lb, accufab reg, TT (race gas only) chip, RJC plate, K&N, test pipe, SM
( parts I have but not installed yet: 340 pump w/hotwire, Alky kit (Julio), TT chips for alky w/stock turbo and chip for TE44 turbo)
I had the street TT chip in and it ran good. Of course I wanted a little more so ordered the full race chip to run turbo full tilt with race gas, I guess there isn't much improvement between the chips?
 
Mr.Vintage said:
I had the street TT chip in and it ran good. Of course I wanted a little more so ordered the full race chip to run turbo full tilt with race gas, I guess there isn't much improvement between the chips?
Click to expand...

More fuel and timing in the race chip compared to a TT street chip. You probably know that you can not use the race chip with 93/alky.

If you run 18#'s boost with a race chip, it will be really fat! That chip is designed to run 22 psi.
 
WS6 said:
I know that 3 dgerees of retard seems like small knock,and I'll agree that it probably won't pop on you anytime soon. But 3 degrees of retard means you're leaving HP on the table. It doesn't take allot of work to tune that out.
Click to expand...


+1 All true, good info. I should say that if I see 3 degrees of detonation it's in transition between gears or if the car shifts down to 1st on a roll (which I try to avoid shocking the trans by doing a WOT when the car is cruising in 2nd)
But yeah I agree that the load in 3rd gear is much greater and with any knock is not good. I mention between gears because I think that the shift kit I had in the last trans was pretty abrupt. The SM used to show several degrees of retard just slowly speeding up and the gear change from 1st to 2nd causing knock to show, before I got new trans. Also seems that the tie down helped with the motor shifting and causing knock with the down pipe bumping. How much knock have all of you audibly heard in your car with closed exhaust @ WOT? The most I ever actually heard was when I tried a ATR Pitbull chip back in 1990. That was a shitty chip.
 
THANKS FOR INFO ON THE KR's Guy's that valuable info!!
O2 SENSOR WAS GOING OUT!!!!!! (Good thing I only spent 5 hours chasing that LOL) Lesson: Back to the basics, I think what was throwing me off is I replace the factory regulator with an Accufab unit and maybe it increases fuel pressure a little differently? Anyway I changed O2 sensor and all numbers are back to normal :dance: mid 850's 0 KR!! now I'm tuning from there.
BTW that O2 sensor was only like a year old. TORCO 118 fuel must tear them up?!?!? (40 gallons worth) Good news is I bought a bosch from Auto zone and they have a 1 year warranty. Won't be buying anymore :rofl:
Thankyou, to whoever took the time it takes to put this site up!! It's really nice to have a place to post problems and get some help and input. Hope I can do the same for others
BTW: any TTA's in Albuquerque NM? that you guy's know of?
 
Good reading... I have the same problem with 3-4 degrees in 3 rd but havent had time to play.. Heading to a rental next week to play and i have about the same mods... i'm a newbie here, probably not the cause but get that 22 yr old pump out of there soon and put the hot wire kit in even if it only has 9k ... Thanks
 
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