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i need a new turbo

E

echostatic

Turbooo
well when i bought my TTA about 2 years ago the ad stated it had a p-61 turbocharger in it. i never had much reason to look inside until recently, when my car seemed to be losing oil. its about 1 quart every 1200 miles and its not leaking, so i thought the turbo might be leaking. when i checked for burnt oil inside the turbo, i noticed the word garrett on the side, so im thinking its still the stock turbo. on top of that, 2 of the blades are broken. suprisingly, it still spools to 23lbs of boost with no apparent problem, but im sure i would get much better performance out of an aftermarket turbo without any broken blades :)

my father recently got a turbo for his grand national and found it didnt bolt up to the harness, so i want to make sure i get a turbo that will bolt to the harness, and use the same wastegate. my car has stock injectors and a stock intercooler, any thoughts?
 
Get a 61 if you do those mods. My 61 spools like stock with my stall.

I am here to tell you the 60 lb injectors idle like stock. I dont know why you would waste money on 36 pounders.
 
The TA-49 doesn't need a different stall and 3200 these days is too much for the street when you consider the Ball Bearing tech turbos available. Keep it tight, the guys in the 10's say your trap speed will be a bit more with a tighter convertor due to the coupling rate at the top end. (check out the trans section at the buick forums. Cotton sells a BB version the TA-49, It would spool like a pissed off comanchee with the stock convertor. A 3200 is more suited to like a 66 or 67 standard journal or even the BB, then your for sure going to have traction problems. If your needing to change your convertor due to age or a wear and tear issue, do something like a 2800 to 3000, this is plenty of convertor for the new style BB turbos up to a 67 to spool fast. It would give you room to grow. Also, Cotton posted something about a BB turbo SALE going on now. I think it's your choice of a 61,66,67 and some even larger 3 bolt style turbos for $995. I paid $1450 last year for my 61BB. You would have to change your wastegate actuator, but it's not a problem and all the original hardware will work, the turbo cover will fit, at least it did on my 61. Also, you don't HAVE to run the water plumbing to the turbo like I did, probably overkill, so install is easy. Oh yeah, I think that if your not going bigger downpipe that you may have spool up issues to a slight degree with the 61 and up turbos due to back pressure of the little stock downpipe, can't say for sure on that since I had my 3" DP installed on my stocker, my TE-44 (which is the same a 49 with a to4B style compressor housing) and my 61. All the above is just my lil ol opinion. You all can fire away at me now.:guns::chat::cowboy:
 
sverble said:
The TA-49 doesn't need a different stall and 3200 these days is too much for the street when you consider the Ball Bearing tech turbos available. Keep it tight, the guys in the 10's say your trap speed will be a bit more with a tighter convertor due to the coupling rate at the top end. (check out the trans section at the buick forums. Cotton sells a BB version the TA-49, It would spool like a pissed off comanchee with the stock convertor. A 3200 is more suited to like a 66 or 67 standard journal or even the BB, then your for sure going to have traction problems. If your needing to change your convertor due to age or a wear and tear issue, do something like a 2800 to 3000, this is plenty of convertor for the new style BB turbos up to a 67 to spool fast. It would give you room to grow. Also, Cotton posted something about a BB turbo SALE going on now. I think it's your choice of a 61,66,67 and some even larger 3 bolt style turbos for $995. I paid $1450 last year for my 61BB. You would have to change your wastegate actuator, but it's not a problem and all the original hardware will work, the turbo cover will fit, at least it did on my 61. Also, you don't HAVE to run the water plumbing to the turbo like I did, probably overkill, so install is easy. Oh yeah, I think that if your not going bigger downpipe that you may have spool up issues to a slight degree with the 61 and up turbos due to back pressure of the little stock downpipe, can't say for sure on that since I had my 3" DP installed on my stocker, my TE-44 (which is the same a 49 with a to4B style compressor housing) and my 61. All the above is just my lil ol opinion. You all can fire away at me now.:guns::chat::cowboy:
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I agree with everything you said except one thing...The cost between a 61 and a BB61 is significant. Not sure he wants to throw that kind of money right now.

Jason
 
Quiky One said:
I agree with everything you said except one thing...The cost between a 61 and a BB61 is significant. Not sure he wants to throw that kind of money right now.

Jason
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What's the standard 61, like $585? Cotton's offering them for $995! That's as good as it will get for a while, then again, biz is tough right now and good deals may get better. I'd almost sale my 61BB for $600 and get a 66 or 67. Here we go again!:dance:
 
echostatic said:
according to an earlier thread i started in this section, i should upgrade to a 3200 stall if i were to do cam and heads in the future, which i plan to do at some point.

so whats a good STRONG transmission? - Turbo Trans Am Forum

^ the thread i referenced
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I think that thread overall was leaning towards standard journal turbo convertors not BB, which may need to be higher stall. If you go Cam and heads, don't know as I've never done that. If your going heads and cam then I'm guessing higher shift points a bit to make use of more air and fuel, I don't think you have to run as high a boost to make same power with heads and cam. Another can of worms, You would then not need to run a larger turbo to get an efficient 19+ psi, then a TE44 or TA49 would be an adequate turbo a and a quick spool with a stock convertor. I've seen many a GN and you can read about them as well on the buickturbo.com site that have gone mid 11's at 117mph-ish on a TE44 or TA49 with supporting mods (Champion heads and cam generally being listed). Combo, combo, combo! It never ends, and I'm still guessing based on experience and what I've asked others. Quicky One has a Pat's 3200. What ya think of it with your current 61 Quicky?
 
I would never use a Turbonetics turbo for a few reasons. I am not going to get in a pissing match but thats my opinion.

61 regular bearing-http://fullthrottlespeed.com/itemdesc~CartId~{6BFA473C-939C-4E34-AADD-F68EVEREST79475E4C2}~ic~628GT6152~eq~~Tp~.htm

61 BB-http://fullthrottlespeed.com/itemdesc~CartId~{6BFA473C-939C-4E34-AADD-F68EVEREST79475E4C2}~ic~628GTB6176~eq~~Tp~.htm
 
sverble said:
I think that thread overall was leaning towards standard journal turbo convertors not BB, which may need to be higher stall. If you go Cam and heads, don't know as I've never done that. If your going heads and cam then I'm guessing higher shift points a bit to make use of more air and fuel, I don't think you have to run as high a boost to make same power with heads and cam. Another can of worms, You would then not need to run a larger turbo to get an efficient 19+ psi, then a TE44 or TA49 would be an adequate turbo a and a quick spool with a stock convertor. I've seen many a GN and you can read about them as well on the buickturbo.com site that have gone mid 11's at 117mph-ish on a TE44 or TA49 with supporting mods (Champion heads and cam generally being listed). Combo, combo, combo! It never ends, and I'm still guessing based on experience and what I've asked others. Quicky One has a Pat's 3200. What ya think of it with your current 61 Quicky?
Click to expand...
My car shifts at 5600-5700 RPM's and goes through the traps at 5700 @119 ish. My valvetrain is still kicking 29 passes later...

On the converter...never again will I order a 10" one. I will only buy 9" from now on. After feeling the difference I wish I woulda paid the $400 more but thats my fault. They are much more efficient up top.

My next tranny will have a Vigiliante converter.

With that being said, I was not able to lock up the converter. My car ran great until it go to BG then every little problem aroused. The headers are coming off, Tbrake going in, and new boost lines everywhere. I'll let ya know how it goes after that is done.

Jason
 
Quiky One said:
I am here to tell you the 60 lb injectors idle like stock. I dont know why you would waste money on 36 pounders.
Click to expand...

:headbang:+1 , I could not be happier w/ the 60's. 36 lbs. (blue tops) w/ the TE44 use to be a the setup back in the day, right?:coffee:
 
im afraid i dont understand your reasoning for not buying their turbo based on what they said in that paragraph you linked o.0 do you believe it to be false?
 
echostatic said:
im afraid i dont understand your reasoning for not buying their turbo based on what they said in that paragraph you linked o.0 do you believe it to be false?
Click to expand...

No, I believe their information to be true. Turbonetics is an old company and from what I've been told, they started the BB technology in the early 90's. That paragraph was pro Turbonetics and the reason I would buy them over the Precision turbos. Both are good brands, I just think the Turbonetics is bit better for the reasons they gave on their website.
If I where in your position, and I think you've said that your TTA is a daily driver in other post, but I'd go with a TA49 (stock appearing) or the TE44 which is the same as the 49 only that it's compressor housing is more open, it doesn't have the bottle neck like the stocker and is worth about 10 or so horse over the 49. You should check all the turbo buick sites in the for sale section. A 49 or 44 pops up for sale all the time. They are going for about $450 to $500 used, that's in good condition. I would ask for close up pics and mileage. Check out the seller's posts and see if they have been a reputable member for at least a year.
I sold my TE44 on turbobuick.com back in the late fall for $485. It was really nice, low miles and I sent the buyer several hig rez pics before he bought it.
 
OH ok, i dunno why but i thought you were saying you would never buy from turbonetics... nevermind that then. i guess i have to figure out what i want to do now.
 
im thinking maybe the BB version of the TA-49 would work well. my transmission isnt as tight as it should be and id like to replace it before it breaks, so i figured a stall convertor would be a logical upgrade to make at the same time as well. im also considering a small shot of nitrous though, around a 50-75 shot. im not sure if itd be worth doing both a stall and nitrous though, but im sure i wouldnt need a 3200 stall. maybe just around 2800. i have no idea what my traction would be like with this though. DontKnow:

the 60lb injectors are still on my mind as well

edit: i was looking at cottons website and i see a ta-49, but no bb version o.0?
 
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NOS allows to spool up a larger turbo. I'm just throwing this out there, but how about:
a CPT 70BB, 3000 stall, 60# inj, and bring it out on launch with about 25 shot of NOS... 3000 stall is kinda mild, would probably work well with that big of a BB turbo cruising without NOS assist and then the NOS would get it spooling from a dig/race.
I'm just guessing, I haven't tried NOS or that large of a turbo on a stock head/motor/cam. This is an interesting link about NOS found here:
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/alcohol-nitrous-propane-tech/237973-nitrous-assisted-launch.html
 
my main concern with all of this is traction of course, power on the street is as important as on the track. i dont expect to be able to launch on the street without spinning much, i can launch alright now but with these mods im sure id spin a lot. street slicks would improve things though, i wodner what i could get away with using those.

any idea what the spool time would be like on a turbo like that with those mods without NOS? i enjoy spirited driving and if the spool time without NOS on a 70 would be too slow i might need to compromise there. i do find your idea very interesting though.
 
does anyone have experience running nitrous on a turbo/alky car? i know you get more out of nitrous on a turbod car, but im not sure what adding nitrous would do to it.

edit: in my research i came across this in a faq at holley.com...

QUESTION Is it a good idea to use an aftermarket computer chip in conjunction with an NOS System?
ANSWER Only if the chip has been designed specifically for use with nitrous oxide. Most aftermarket chips use more aggressive timing advance curves to create more power. This can lead to possible detonation. You may wish to check with the manufacturer of the chip before using it. The top manufacturers, such as Hypertech do make special chips for use with nitrous.

im running the turbotweak alky chip. ill be getting an updated whip, but their alky chip adds 21-23 degrees of timing. i am wondering if i will be able to use an alky chip with nitrous, or if im going to have to go a completely different route. i might just have to go post about this at the turbo buick forum.
 
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echostatic said:
my main concern with all of this is traction of course, power on the street is as important as on the track. i dont expect to be able to launch on the street without spinning much, i can launch alright now but with these mods im sure id spin a lot. street slicks would improve things though, i wodner what i could get away with using those.

any idea what the spool time would be like on a turbo like that with those mods without NOS? i enjoy spirited driving and if the spool time without NOS on a 70 would be too slow i might need to compromise there. i do find your idea very interesting though.
Click to expand...

If street traction is important stay stock...My 3200 stall and 61 has no traction at less than half throttle on street tires.
 
echostatic said:
does anyone have experience running nitrous on a turbo/alky car? i know you get more out of nitrous on a turbod car, but im not sure what adding nitrous would do to it.

edit: in my research i came across this in a faq at holley.com...

QUESTION Is it a good idea to use an aftermarket computer chip in conjunction with an NOS System?
ANSWER Only if the chip has been designed specifically for use with nitrous oxide. Most aftermarket chips use more aggressive timing advance curves to create more power. This can lead to possible detonation. You may wish to check with the manufacturer of the chip before using it. The top manufacturers, such as Hypertech do make special chips for use with nitrous.

im running the turbotweak alky chip. ill be getting an updated whip, but their alky chip adds 21-23 degrees of timing. i am wondering if i will be able to use an alky chip with nitrous, or if im going to have to go a completely different route. i might just have to go post about this at the turbo buick forum.
Click to expand...

If you are serious about nitrous you really need to talk to Eric direct. I would not risk a motor thinking something might work. I would hate for you to lose even a headgasket over something as simple as a $75 chip. Feeling me?

Jason
 
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